EXCERPTS FROM DISCOURSE DELIVERED IN THE TABERNACLE, SALT LAKE CITY, APRIL 26, 1914—METHODIST EPISCOPAL MINISTER CONVERTED TO MORMONISM—GOES TO ENGLAND AS A MORMON MISSIONARY—CALLS UPON HIS FORMER MINISTER—HIS UNDIGNIFIED RECEPTION—ANTI "MORMON" ASSERTION DISPROVED BY FACTS—A MINISTER'S CONFESSION—PUZZLING QUESTIONS PROPOUNDED TO MINISTERS, UNANSWERED—ATTITUDE OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS THEREON—UNSEEN EVIDENCE OF POWER—A PREDICTION BY THE GIFT OF TONGUES THAT WAS LITERALLY FULFILLED—TRUTH ONLY STRENGTHENED BY ATTEMPTS TO OVERTHROW IT—KARL G. MAESER'S CONVERSION—HIS PLEDGE AND ITS FULFILLMENT—BEN BUTLER'S ADVICE.

I rejoice in a testimony of the divinity of the gospel of Jesus Christ, as revealed to the Prophet Joseph Smith in our day. I rejoice in being able to proclaim to all the world that I know that Joseph Smith was a prophet of the true and living God; that I know the gospel of Jesus Christ, commonly called "Mormonism," is in very deed the plan of life and salvation; that it is that gospel which it was proclaimed should in the latter-days be restored again to the earth by an angel flying in the midst of heaven, proclaiming it to every nation, kindred, tongue and people upon the face of the earth.

"O," says one, "but I do not believe that you have this knowledge." Yet, the fact remains that individual disbelief regarding some information and knowledge that another man has cannot change the knowledge of that man, if in very deed he has it. I know nothing of chemistry. Therefore, when a chemist tells me certain things in a sugar factory, his statement may seem absurd to me. When he tells me that by pouring two half-filled glasses of water together that water will immediately change to red, blue, green or some other color, it seems absurd to me because the water appears to me to be perfectly pure and colorless. But with the knowledge that the chemist has, he knows what the result will be when he makes this mixture, and he demonstrates before our eyes the truth of all the statements he makes.

Now, we maintain, as Latter-day Saints, that men and women who will look into and examine and study the gospel of Jesus Christ, as revealed in our day through the Prophet Joseph Smith, can demonstrate its truth to their reasoning faculties; and if they will pray to God for the inspiration of His spirit to guide and enlighten their minds, they can also demonstrate by the Spirit of God, the divinity of this work in which we are engaged.

I call to mind that while presiding over the European mission, one of the most eloquent preachers, one of the best reasoners upon the gospel, among the Elders who went out to preach while I was there, was Benjamin Burchell, who came to Utah as a young man from England, to be a preacher, if I recollect aright, for the Methodist Episcopal church. His field of labor was Nephi, Juab county. The superintendent of his church for this inter-mountain region gave him instructions, one of which was: "Don't read the Book of Mormon; don't read any of the 'Mormon' literature;" and the superintendent gave him a great deal of anti-'Mormon' literature to read and study. The young man loaded his double-barrelled gun, so to speak, with anti-'Mormon' bullets, and one of the men that he fired them at was the bishop of one of the wards in Nephi; and they didn't seem to hurt the bishop any. He said in substance, "Who filled you full of those lies?" The young man said: "They are not lies; they are true." The bishop replied: "How do you know they are true? I have lived here all my life, and I know that everything you have said is false."

The young man became interested. He said, "Bishop, can I come down to your house and spend an evening with you?" "Come along and you can spend a dozen"; and he did spend an evening, two or three evenings, and bought the Book of Mormon and studied the gospel. He afterwards resigned his salary received from the Methodist Episcopal church and went back to England—not for a salary—to preach the gospel, but he went back without money and without price, and at his own expense, to proclaim the gospel of Jesus Christ which he had found to be true and which he had embraced. One of the first men that he called on was the minister of the church that he belonged to before he came to Utah. The minister was delighted to meet him, and welcomed him back home. He had heard nothing of his conversion to "Mormonism." The young man took some "Mormon" tracts out of his pocket, and he said in substance to the minister: "I wish you would tell me how to answer these claims of the Latter-day Saints." He then asked a number of questions. The minister commenced floundering around like a fish out of water, and finally he turned, and with a word that some people say is not profanity but only emphasis, he shook his fist at the young man and said "D—n you, I believe you have joined that church." The young man smiled and said "Yes." Then he jumped up, and with some more emphasis he ordered him out of his house. That is the way he answered the arguments of the young man.

I hold in my hand a letter written by a man who came to Utah, representing a church here; and he was told that we Latter-day Saints, commonly called "Mormons," were practically a lot of heathens and barbarians. He discovered we were an intelligent people; that we were a God-fearing people; that we had brotherly love one for another; that we were industrious; that according to the Savior's rule—"By their fruits ye shall know them"—that this was about the finest community he had ever lived in. He lived in one of our southern counties. Afterwards he was transferred to one of our northern counties, and he found that same state of affairs; and finally he writes:

"You will agree with me that from the position of a regularly ordained minister to the confession of truth and divinity of the gospel of 'Mormonism' is a long road to travel. It is because I believe that I have traveled that road that I want to write to you. As I see it now, this is my confession of faith. I believe that the gospel of Christ is taught in its purity by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. I believe that Joseph Smith was a prophet of God, and that his work is owned of God. I believe in the restoration of the gospel and in the authority of the priesthood, and I believe that the sects of modern Christendom are the result of the spiritual darkness in the world. I know from experience how impossible it is for the blind to lead the blind."

I remember when I was in Europe—and I have quoted it many times—reading with a great deal of interest a book entitled, "The Young Man and the World," written by Senator Beveridge. In this book the senator said that during an entire summer vacation, a man with good opportunities to get proper answers, asked of a large number of ministers through the New England states, three questions:

"Do you believe in God, the Father; God a person, God a definite and tangible intelligence—not a congeries of laws floating like a fog through the universe; but God a person in whose image you were made? Don't argue; don't explain; but is your mind in a condition where you can answer yes or no?" Not one minister answered, Yes.

The next question was: "Do you believe that Christ was the son of the living God, sent by him to save the world? I am not asking whether you believe that he was inspired in the sense that the great moral teachers are inspired—nobody has any difficulty about that. But do you believe that Christ was God's very Son, with a divinely appointed and definite mission, dying on the cross and raised from the dead?" Not one minister answered, Yes.

The third question was: "Do you believe that when you die you will live again as a conscious intelligence, knowing who you are and who other people are?" Not a man answered Yes.

He said that these ministers were particularly high-grade ministers. Many of them had gained renown for their piety and for their eloquence in proclaiming the gospel, as they understood it, and yet all of them were regretting the lack of interest in the gospel and the absence of audiences to listen to their preaching. Mr. Beveridge says: "How could such priests of ice warm the souls of men? How could such apostles of interrogation convert a world?" There are no priests of interrogation among the Latter-day Saints. The answer by every preacher of the gospel of Jesus Christ, as restored through the Prophet Joseph Smith, to these questions, down to our children that go to Sabbath school, is Yes, Yes, Yes, without a moment's hesitation. There is no doubt; there is no dubiety in the hearts of the Latter-day Saints. We have, behind the shadow of a doubt, the absolute witness of the Spirit that God lives, that Jesus is the Christ, that Joseph Smith was a prophet of the true and living God. We know that the gifts and graces that belonged in the ancient church are to be found here today; we know that the gift of tongues is enjoyed by the Latter-day Saints; and these are some of the fruits of the gospel of Jesus Christ as enjoyed by the early Saints.

"O, but—" says one, "I don't believe that you have any gift of tongues by the inspiration of the spirit of God."

As a boy, I once took hold of the ends of an electric battery. They had some handles for me to take hold of. I was a child at that time. I had never had any shock of electricity; and the teacher who was manipulating it was not very well posted, and he turned on altogether too strong a current, and I could not let go. I hopped around there and yelled "Turn it off, turn it off!" Well, somebody who did not see, or feel, or know anything about electricity would say, "What is the matter with that fool, with a couple of pieces of tin in his hand, yelling 'Turn it off?'"

Could anybody tell me that I did not know, as a boy in old Brother Doremus's school, that I got a solid shock of electricity? Not a bit of it. I know that I received the electric shock; there is no doubt of it in my mind. Likewise, I know that the gift of tongues is in this church. Why? Because when I was ruined financially, working till midnight, every night, struggling to maintain my honor and my credit, when I came home one morning—between 1 and 2 o'clock in the morning—my wife, whose body now lies in the tomb, was sitting up waiting for me, and I chided her for it; she turned and by the gift of tongues, and having the interpretation thereof herself, she gave me a wonderful and marvelous blessing, every word of which has been fulfilled. I knew well that she was giving me a blessing, as I sat there and wept like a child, while she was addressing me, without understanding a single word that she said, I know that God testified to me that she was giving me a blessing just as well as I know that I received the electric shock.

When I was a boy, playing upon the floor in a Relief society meeting,—my mother being the president of a Relief society, (I grew up in the Relief society, and I have often said I am entitled to be a member, a charter member almost)—in that meeting I heard Grandma Whitney sing some of the most beautiful songs I have ever listened to, and they were all sung in an unknown tongue. After she finished Sister Eliza R. Snow (who wrote the famous "Mormon" hymn, "O My Father," which refers to our heavenly mother) gave a blessing to each of those present. I heard President Smith say that he attended a concert given by our Tabernacle choir at the World's fair, in Chicago; and one of the songs, "O My Father," was sung by Robert C. Easton. When it came to the part, "Truth is reason, truth eternal, Tells me I've a mother there," a man sitting by, said, "I have believed that all my life, but I daren't say so." Well, we dare say it and have said it all over the world. The sister who, by the inspiration of the Spirit of God, wrote that hymn, gave to each one of the good sisters in that Relief society meeting a blessing. Zina D. Young gave the interpretation. After this blessing had been given to each of the good sisters, Sister Snow turned to the child on the floor and gave him a blessing, and Aunt Zina interpreted it, and the blessing was a prediction that I should live to occupy the position that I am occupying here today as one of the leaders in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. I am the recipient of a blessing predicted by the gift of tongues and fulfilled twenty years afterward. I could go on and relate incident after incident of a like character.

In the letter of this man that I referred to, there were some things that reminded me very much of the conversion of Karl G. Maeser. What led the former to more thoroughly investigate the gospel, after leaving Utah, was the reading of an attack on the Latter-day Saints, which threatened to destroy the whole structure; and he was disappointed with the attack, and so went on with his investigation. When I was a youngster—I am getting away from the Maeser incident, but I will return—when I was a youngster I read the book entitled Nelson on Infidelity. Mr. Nelson said that he was ready and willing to loan any young man any number of volumes in favor of the infidel idea, if the young man would only read the other side; and further he said in substance: "The reason I am ready and willing to loan any number of books on the infidel side, is that if the young man will read the answer he will discover that his champion is lying; and every time a man discovers that his leader is lying, it weakens his faith in him even when he tells the truth. During my three years' presidency of the European mission, I never found any of the ministers over there who did not warn all their flock against the literature and the teachings of the Latter-day Saints; yet I never warned our missionaries, some of whom had never spoken in public before, against the literature of any religion. In all the world, for eighty years, the ministers of Christendom have never converted even one poor, down-trodden, ignorant "Mormon" missionary; but we have captured ministers; we have captured their divines and their leading men; and Wilford Woodruff captured all their churches in one community and baptized sixteen hundred people, including most of their ministers, and all in eight months."

Now, coming back to Karl G. Maeser, who was a professor in a German university. He had that discriminating, analytical German mind which searches down to the bottom of things. He read in an illustrated magazine that the "Mormons" were barbarians, an adulterous, wicked lot of people; that a man opposed to them, took his life in his hands, when he walked the streets of Salt Lake. That reminds me of something else (I will have to leave Maeser for a moment). There was a gentleman who went to Washington from Utah and tried to get the seat in Congress belonging to George Q. Cannon. He told all such stories, and when he had finished all that Brother Cannon said was: "He is still alive. If what that man has said were true, we would have buried him long ago." When Ben Butler visited Salt Lake City, the anti-"Mormons" gave him a dinner (five dollars a plate) and told him that the "Mormons" ought to be disfranchised; and that all those who opposed them were taking their lives in their hands. Ben replied in substance: "I believe what you have said. I have a remedy. The United States is broad. Leave this d—d country and don't take any chances, gentlemen, of getting killed."

Karl G. Maeser read a vicious attack upon the "Mormons"—about the "Danites" and the "Destroying Angels," and so on, and so forth. Then he found in the same article that the "Mormons" were industrious, that they were frugal, that there was not a poor-house in all the territory of Utah, that the fifteen per cent of Gentile population, among them then furnished eighty-five per cent of the criminals, according to United States statistics, compiled by the Gentiles themselves. He found that there was not one saloon in the entire territory of Utah, and that the only place where whiskey was sold was in Salt Lake City; and, to the disgrace of the city government, they were selling it. That is what he found on the temperance question. He found that there was not a single house of ill fame in the whole of Utah. He found that the people went to bed at night with their front and back doors open. After reading all this he said to himself: "The man who wrote this illustrated article for the magazine is a liar. The fruits of honesty, industry sobriety, and brotherly love do not grow among immoral and wicked people," so he sent for some tracts, investigated the gospel and embraced it. On the night of his baptism, which occurred at midnight, he looked up to heaven and said, in substance: "O, God, if what I have done tonight meets with your approval, and you will give to me the witness of the Spirit that this gospel, that I believe, is in very deed the truth, that I may know it, I pledge my life, if need be, to its promulgation and its advancement."

From Canada on the north to Mexico on the south there are thousands, yes, tens of thousands, who can bear witness that this pledge, made at Dresden, Germany, at midnight, was fulfilled by one of the most devoted, unselfish, and self-sacrificing mortals who ever embraced the gospel of Christ. For if any man ever gave his life, his heart, and his soul for the advancement of this cause, Karl G. Maeser did so. God heard and answered that prayer. Walking from the river in which he was baptized, Karl G. Maeser was conversing upon the principles of the gospel with the late Apostle Franklin D. Richards, and Brother William Budge was acting as interpreter. Brother Richards talking in English and Brother Maeser in German. They began their walk of several miles to return home. After walking a short distance Brother Maeser announced to Brother Budge that he need not interpret the answers, that he understood them. Immediately thereafter, Brother Franklin said, "You need not interpret those questions; I understand them." They walked for miles, Franklin D. Richards answering questions in English, Karl G. Maeser asking them in German, neither knowing the other's language, yet by the inspiration of the Spirit of God, both understanding each other. Do you tell me that I don't know that we have the gift of tongues in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints? As well tell me that I do not know that I am standing here before you today. I have this testimony from the lips of a man, than whom no more honest, no more upright, no truer man ever drew the breath of life. When these two men reached the bridge that spans the river Elbe, on their way into the city of Dresden, they were separated, and when they reached the other side of the bridge Brother Maeser again began asking questions, but Brother Richards could not then understand him, nor could Brother Maeser understand anything further that was said in reply; and they were obliged to revert to Brother Budge's interpretation. Then Brother Maeser turned to Brother Richards and said, "What does this mean, we could understand each other for miles, and now we can't understand?" "Brother Maeser," said Apostle Richards, "the Lord has given to you a portion of the fruit of the gospel of Jesus Christ, as restored in our day. For some wise reason he has allowed you to enjoy one of the manifestations of the Spirit accompanying the true gospel of Christ." Brother Maeser told me, with tears rolling down his cheeks, although it had been nearly 50 years since he had that manifestation, that he realized that God had heard and answered his prayers. At the close of the incident I have related, Brother Maeser looked up again into heaven, and he said: "O God, my Father in heaven, I will fulfil my promise to give my life to this cause"; and he did it. He became the grand old man, educationally, of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints—a man without a thought of personal aggrandizement, without a thought of seeking honor for himself, personally, but with only a desire to save souls, to build up the kingdom of God, and to promulgate this gospel at home and abroad.

I rejoice in the fact that in every land and in every clime, wherever this gospel message has penetrated, the fruits of the gospel have been enjoyed—the healing of the sick, speaking in tongues, the interpretation of tongues, every gift and grace, and every power that was ever enjoyed by the former-day Saints, are enjoyed by the Latter-day Saints. I rejoice in knowing that I myself stand here today a living witness to the healing power of Almighty God, that is in the Church of Christ. Given up by eight doctors to die, yet under the inspiration of the Spirit of God, the man who is now the prophet of God, on the earth, said as he blessed me that I should live, and I do live, notwithstanding the doctors said that blood poisoning in the third and last stage had set in, in my case. My family physician told me to send for my reporter, and tell my last little story, because I was doomed to die. Did I send for the reporter? No. Perfect faith gave me to know I should live. Although my doctor told me I should die, Sister Grant and I knew to the contrary. She received a visit from my wife, whose body lies in the tomb, the same wife who enjoyed the gift of tongues and its interpretation. After her death, she came to my home, before I was operated upon, and told my wife no matter how seriously ill I was, I should not die, that I should live, because my mission was not yet ended; that I should yet lift up my voice in many lands, and many climes, proclaiming the restitution of the gospel to the earth. So, when the doctors said I must die, Sister Grant and I had no dear, because we knew better. I asked how long I could live; the doctors said, "not over three days." At the end of three days, I was better, and they could not understand it. So they had the poisonous pus from my body analysed again; and lo and behold, according to their verdict, I ought to have been dead two days; but I was getting better. I was promised by the gift of tongues, that I should lift up my voice in many lands and many climes, proclaiming this gospel. At the time of this operation, I was promised by the visitation of my deceased wife that I should not die, that my mission was not ended. Since then I have been in Japan; I have been in Canada; I have been in Mexico; I have preached from Portland, Me., to Portland, Or.; from Canada on the north to Mexico on the south. I have been over the British Isles, England, Ireland, Scotland, Wales—in Scandinavia, France, Germany, Italy and Belgium, proclaiming that God lives; and yet, according to the doctors, I ought to have been dead. I have thus seen fulfilled the promise made by that visitation of my wife, that I should live and proclaim this gospel. I know that God lives, that Jesus is the Christ, that Joseph Smith is his prophet, and that "Mormonism," so called by the world, is indeed the gospel of life and salvation, the gospel of Jesus Christ, again restored to the earth. God help us, who have this testimony, to live in conformity with its doctrines, is my prayer, in the name of our Lord and Master. Amen.